Great point. Too often we limit God.

I’m pretty sure I have missed countless times of God attempting to speak to me because I wasn’t tuned-in.

Scotts last blog post..Dumbing Down the Rhetoric

So, how does your perspective, that Jesus is getting all the press (which I will admit I do seem to be guilty of at times, but only because I lack the means to fully express myself) – how does this perspective influence your interpretation of the widely held church doctrine that one can only be saved through an acceptance of Jesus of Nazareth as their savior?

If God is speaking to us all the time through his creation (and I agree he is) and we don’t need to see things through ‘Jesus-goggles’ to understand him (which I now realize) then what justification do we have in saying that only those who know of the 1st century Christ will be saved? (which I don’t).

Christians last blog post..Curtains

True. And as a Christian raised in the West I think that is excellent advice. But much of what we consider Biblical Truth is speculative as well. Some of the other options may be ambiguous but still leading towards the truth while some of the “clear” doctrines may actually be leading away from the truth. I just quoted Lewis on my blog (thanks for the link) while addressing this question. At one point he says:

There are people (a great many of them) whoare slowly ceasing to be Christians but who still call themselves by thatname: some of them are clergymen.There are other people who are slowly becoming Christians though they do not yet call themselves so. There are people who do not accept the full Christian doctrine about Christ but who are so strongly attracted by Him that they are His in a much deeper sense than they themselves understand. There are people in other religions who are being led by God’s secret influence to concentrate on those parts of their religion which are in agreement with Christianity, and who thus belong to Christ without knowing it.

Christians last blog post..Curtains

I wouldn’t use any one’s thoughts or writings for justification but they do come in handy for clarification, especially if someone is as articulate as Lewis.

But I think you are missing my point. I agree, that in our situation, considering where we live and how we have been raised, Jesus is the safe bet (whatever that really means). But does that mean that we are compelled to go out and convert the world? Or does that just help to ‘muddy’ their waters as well as ours?

Christians last blog post..Curtains

Gotcha. And last time I checked, I haven’t converted anyone myself (but you never know about those little seeds….)

I think you are right, as Christians, it makes sense to share the Gospel with everyone, perhaps even with some of those Christians that have yet to ‘convert’. But I guess that is where I am trying to go with this. In an attempt to more like Christ, perhaps (hopefully) showing Jesus to people with your own actions, many lead people closer to God but it may not manifest itself in the obvious ‘change’ that so many of us might expect or hope for.

Christians last blog post..Curtains

What’s holy? Not for God, but for us? Can you define it – quantify – grade it? Wouldn’t the law that sums up all the laws be a prescription for holiness?

No, Kemosabe, that was my point. You can’t define it or quantify it or grade it. So how do you aspire to it? Perhaps concentrating on some type of code of personal behavior(like the “fundie legalists” do – they’re really not mean, they only seem that way) is a case of missing the forest for the trees. And I think you are fixated on McLaren.

“the only way you can justify what you do not understand is to blame it on the messed up humans…”

You mean like the “God sanctioned” genocide? I understand it perfectly well; the Israelites just stamped God’s seal of approval on some things they did that weren’t too ‘holy’ – just as many continue to do. Then again maybe its just better to justify inconsistencies in the Bible by saying “Well, it’s a mystery”. But then what point is God trying to make here? Or should we just set these uncomfortable things aside until we can ask him face to face?

And I never said ‘the law that sums up the laws is contained within the laws”- you own that line and it is a conundrum. What I said was that this one ‘law’ is found in the OT and the NT. The various ‘laws’ are poor attempts to get people to hold to the one law. It doesn’t work – Jesus shows us a way that does.

You know that this whole inerrant and infallible Bible thing has only been Protestant doctrine for the last 150 years or so. It’s not a particularly ‘biblical’ idea itself.

Christians last blog post..Written on the Heart: Some Thoughts on the Law

Well, Jesus may have found it important that in addition to being the messiah (but not as far as anyone knew at the time) he was a rabbi. It’s kind of tough to relate all of Leviticus and Deuteronomy to people who aren’t Jewish and no longer hold to the Jewish traditions or holidays. This is probably a natural result of the early Church’s de-Jewification of Yeshua.

It’s interesting that the Christians who seem to identify the most with the Old Testament Jews are the African-Americans.

Christians last blog post..Written on the Heart: Some Thoughts on the Law

Right. And one aspect of that is how God has inextricably tied the personal salvation of every Jew with the salvation of the Jews as a whole. God does not intend for his people to live apart from one another, no one is to see his own salvation apart from the salvation of the overarching community (and at times, aliens to that community).I think this understanding is often missing in the Church – it’s not all about personal salvation.

Yeah. Redemption does work a lot better.